Oversigning.com
9Jul/1020

The March to 85 is Over for LSU

We have come to the end of the road for LSU's March to 85.

Reader "Homework" who has been all over the LSU numbers for us sent this in this morning.  If anyone else has more information on the details of Garrett's release from his scholarship, please post them in the comments section.  It appears on the surface, just based on the rivals piece below, that Garrett was simply mailed a notice that his scholarship would not be renewed, which prompted him to ask for a release.  Not sure if that makes sense though; why would you need to ask for a release if you have not been renewed?  

Regardless, it sure was a nice gesture on Les Miles' part to allow him to go to Mississippi State if he wants.   It is total BS how these coaches/schools can controls kids, especially the ones that are being forced out.  We're basically seeing the professionalization of college football minus the players being able to exercise their full rights as a free agent once they get cut. 

We need to gather a little more information on Garrett's situation before we blast Les Miles, but at the moment the whole thing doesn't exactly look good.  We'll try to gather a little more on this story over the weekend and post an update.  Until then you have to ask yourself the question, had LSU been restricted from oversigning their roster would Chris Garrett be leaving the program?  Also, if you subscribe to the notion that Miles knew that he was going to cut Garrett back when he was oversigning his class and basically signing a new recruit to Garrett's scholarship, then why did he wait so long to send him the notice that he would not be renewed?  Honestly, it looks like Miles just goes out and gets as many players as he can get away with and then just figures out how to get the roster down to 85.

LSU coach Les Miles confirmed Thursday night that redshirt freshman quarterback Chris Garrett is leaving the football program.

Garrett had a meeting with Miles on Wednesday and asked for his release. Miles granted Garrett his release. Garrett cannot transfer to any Southeastern Conference school other than Mississippi State.

The family received certified mail last week which indicated that Garrett's scholarship would not be renewed. The head coach has the intent to have a discussion with the player and explain to him what needs to be done for him to remain in the program on scholarship.

http://lsu.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1101349

The March to 85 - LSU

Player Position Reason for Leaving
Akiem Hicks Defensive Tackle Removed from the team - was involved in NCAA investigation
Kyle Prater Linebacker Transfer
Jhyryn Taylor Wide Receiver Transfer
Thomas Parsons Fullback Medical Hardship Scholarship
John Williams Wide Receiver Medical Hardship Scholarship
Clay Spencer Offensive Lineman Medical Hardship Scholarship
Chris Garrett QB Cut - Scholarship Not Renewed
Houston Bates Defensive End Released from LOI in April; refused Greyshirt
Elliott Porter Offensive Lineman Asked to Greyshirt in AUGUST; refused Greyshirt; released


Had LSU been restricted to signing to their limit of 85 and still suffered the same attrition as above, they would be going into the season with 78 players on scholarship.  Instead they will lose these 7 guys and still come in at 85.  What a luxury for the coaching staff at LSU to be able to oversign with reckless abandon.

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  1. “Honestly, it looks like Miles just goes out and gets as many players as he can get away with and then just figures out how to get the roster down to 85.” and What a luxury for the coaching staff at LSU to be able to oversign with reckless abandon.”

    are you applying this uneducated comment to Nick Saban and Houston Nutt, too? Remember Saban cleans house every year to get “his” players in. Houston Nutt signed 30 something players last year. Do you know the rules about how many kids can enroll each year? Do the math.

    “ask yourself the question, had LSU been restricted from oversigning their roster would Chris Garrett be leaving the program?”

    ummm, I’m not the biggest Miles fan but, do you really think he is dumb enough to cut one of only 3 scholarship quarterbacks on his roster rather than one of the 35 offensive line he seems to have on the roster if he was doing it only to make room?

    Also, if Miles was

  2. LSU oversigns with wreckless abandon? Why don’t you check out the real culprits in the SEC: MSU, Ole Miss, Auburn and Alabama. Auburn signed 89 the last 3 years, Alabama signed 85, Ole Miss signed 93 and MSU signed 80. LSU, on the other hand, has signed 79. Those programs had to run more players off to get down to the 85 requirement than LSU.

  3. Man I would really love to go play for an SEC school and have my scholarship be revoked via certified mail, what a family. You are the 3rd string REDSHIRT FRESHMAN and you get cut for not making the grad. If the player was leaving on his own terms there is no way Miles would let him play at ANY SEC school. Come on now let use your head. Also, if LSU has so many OL why do they already have 3 committed to this years class? Answer: because Miles knows he can sign 35 per class, get away with it and just cut down to 85 by ruining kids lives!

    TA,
    This is not singling out LSU in particular. This is singling out the entire SEC because they continue to ruin kids lives due to oversigning.

    • “If the player was leaving on his own terms there is no way Miles would let him play at ANY SEC school. Come on now let use your head.”

      Really? Miles not only let Jones look at ONE school in the SEC, he gave permission to look at TWO. Your “use your head” comment has no weight at all.

      Former LSU cornerback Phelon Jones to transfer to Alabama
      Tuesday, April 28, 2009

      TUSCALOOSA – Alabama football coach Nick Saban turned to his former school to secure secondary help for the future.

      LSU cornerback Phelon Jones, a Mobile native, said he will leave Baton Rouge following the spring semester and play for the Crimson Tide. Jones started two games and made 15 tackles for the Tigers last season.

      The No. 3 player on the 2006 Birmingham News Super Seniors list announced on April 3 that he was transferring from LSU because he wanted more playing time.

      Originally, Jones received clearance from LSU coach Les Miles to speak only with the Auburn coaches. But the family went back to Miles a few days later when it realized Alabama might be a better fit.

      On Thursday, Miles reconsidered and freed Jones up to approach UA.

      “This is not singling out LSU in particular” Again, really? Why is no other school mentioned in the article?

      • Oh boy! That was sure nice of Miles to let him transfer to by far the worst team in the conference. What a stand-up guy. Miles spells it all out in his quote about he was never really able to come in and compete. Behind the scenes that is telling everyone he was forced to transfer to free up a spot. On the other side if he did transfer on his own, if LSU wouldnt have oversigned every year they would be well below the scholarship levels. Every team has attrition and its part of the game but its CHEATING when you dont follow the rules and a school intentionally oversigns.

  4. This says it all! We signed you, youre not good enough because we didnt give you enough time to develop so we are cutting you scholarship. BOOM

    “I wish Chris my best,” Miles said. “In my opinion, he didn’t ever seem to settle in and compete. Chris has talent. He’s a good kid and a great student. I wish him the best.”

    also, Bryan they have 3 on scholarship now with incoming freshman Zach Lee

  5. Joshua writes:

    “We need to gather a little more information on Garrett’s situation before we blast Les Miles, but at the moment the whole thing doesn’t exactly look good.”

    3 sentences later, with no additional information gathered, Joshua writes:

    “Honestly, it looks like Miles just goes out and gets as many players as he can get away with and then just figures out how to get the roster down to 85.”

    About as fair and balanced as Fox News or MSNBC, take your pick.

    If Les Miles was looking to “cut” the bottom player of 86 it wouldn’t have been Garrett. His starting QB, Jordan Jefferson, was mediocre at best last year. The 2nd string QB, Jarrett Lee, threw an incredible 6 pick 6′s as the starter in 2008. 2010 recruit Zach Lee, a first round pick of the L.A. Dodgers, is likely to sign a 7 figure baseball contract and never enroll at LSU.

    The idea that Miles would “cut” Garrett for no reason other than to get down to 85 and potentially be down to Jarrett Lee and walk ons at QB in the event of an injury to Jordan Jefferson is beyond stupid.

    Hey Joshua, now that USC has admitted that their incoming freshman running back (or Lane Kiffin) lied about Alabama and Florida making illegal contact with him, where’s the retraction?

    • Don’t count on it, DP.

      But I want to know when the official petition to the NCAA is going out in the mail. Even though this website has been linked to other websites all over the WWW, I am still guessing that the word hasn’t exactly reached Indy yet. This website is the equivalent of one guy standing up on the back row of a Megadeth concert during the first song, cranked up to 130 db, and telling them to turn down the music.

      • I’m working on it man, real world obligations have consumed my free time lately. But I am definitely working on a petion.

        • why did you delete my post about the fact that this website has LSU ranked 8th in oversigning the SEC? Shouldnt you have targeted Auburn?

          http://oversigning.com/testing/index.php/recruiting-numbers/

          • I didn’t delete it…it was sent to the spam filter automatically. I just released it.

            As to your comment regarding LSU being ranked 8th in oversigning, first of all, we have never ranked teams according to the severity of their oversigning. No where in the link you are referring to does it say this is a list of schools that oversign the most. The link you are referring to is a list of the number of players signed by each school, and if you have been following this site and have a solid understanding of oversigning you would know that there is more to oversigning than just pure numbers.

            You should go here and read this: http://oversigning.com/testing/index.php/2010/05/06/2006-2010-recruiting-numbers/

            Back to LSU. While although their numbers are not as bad as Auburn’s you need to understand the difference between the two situations at LSU and Auburn. Auburn, despite having signed more than any other school in the country, actually had a ton of room for players this year and did not oversign this year. Auburn’s problem over the years has been that they have WAY too many players not qualify or qualify but not stay very long. How they have escaped APR penalties is a complete mystery to me. Regardless, they had room for every single player they signed this year and if you notice, they have not had to lose anyone currently on the roster or rely on someone they signed not making it this year in order to stay under the 85 limit. LSU and Alabama on the other hand purposely signed more players than they had room for on signing day and have had to rely on massive attrition in order to get to 85 before August. Alabama and LSU both really only had room for about 19 – 20 players, yet they both signed well over that amount and both have had to lose a lot of players in order to avoid penalties for being over the 85 limit.

            I hope that clears everything up for you.

            • Joshua,

              Your chart ranks LSU 8th in the SEC regarding the signing of players. The intent of your table is to show how many signees each school in the SEC has compared to the schools in the Big 10, right? Therefore, in the 12 team SEC, LSU has signed the 8th least amount of players over the time period you chose.

              What do you mean….Auburn did not oversign this year? They signed 32 players. A school can only admit 25 no matter what. Thats an over signing of 7 players. Where do they go if all make it? They either get pushed to prep school, jc or grey shirt…right? So, if they all make the grades, 7 players get their dreams smashed.

              According to your website, Auburn has oversigned a total of 28 kids since 2002. Over the same amount of time, LSU has signed -12 kids.

              LSU SEC 26 28 26 13 26 26 26 24 29 224 24.89

              According to your chart, since 2002, the most LSU has “oversigned” in one year is 3 kids. That was the 28 signed in 2003. While your information for 2009 says 29 kids, they only signed 27. Your story makes it sound like LSU is a habitual offender.

              “LSU and Alabama on the other hand purposely signed more players than they had room for on signing day and have had to rely on massive attrition in order to get to 85 before August.” Really?

              Look at your own chart. In 2002, LSU oversigned 1 player, in 2003, they oversigned 3 players, in 2004 they oversigned by 1, in 2005 they undersigned by 12 (if they were as you insinuate, wouldnt they have signed a full class of 25?), in 2006, 2007 and 2008, they oversigned by 1, in 2009, they undersigned by 1 (again, see question for 2005), in 2010, they oversigned by 2.

              I looked up the word MASSIVE in my Websters and LSU’s signing practices don’t seem to fit.

              Let me ask again, why did you focus on LSU for your article?

              • You caught me in a good mood today so I will explain this as politely as I can. First, I don’t think you understand what oversigning really is based on your comments:

                “They signed 32 players. A school can only admit 25 no matter what. Thats an over signing of 7 players. Where do they go if all make it? They either get pushed to prep school, jc or grey shirt…right? So, if they all make the grades, 7 players get their dreams smashed.”

                You are forgetting that schools can count players backwards and forwards; let me explain that again here, even though it is all over this site.

                If a school signs 32 and they all make it in then the school as to do something with 7 players in order to get down to 25 in the current class. IF they have room in the previous class (meaning they didn’t give out a full 25 scholarships last year) then they can count players back to that class provided the players enroll in January. In addition, schools can ask guys to wait to enroll until the following year and count toward the next recruiting class.

                But schools can only do those things if they have room under the 85 limit. The problem for Alabama and LSU has not been the 25 per class limit but rather the 85 total limit. In Alabama’s case, they signed more than they had room for even after getting guys to enroll early and count back and after asking guys to grey shirt and count later – simply put there is no place for the extra guys and that is why you see people leaving the team. Same is the case for LSU.

                The main point you are missing is that oversigning is not simply going over the 25 per class limit – it is going over the 85 limit.

                If you have 68 guys on scholarship on signing day and you sign 29 that is a total of 97 players and no matter what you do people have to leave in order to get down to 85. If you have 68 guys on scholarship, anything more than 17 is oversigning, even if it is under the 25 per class limit.

                I understand that you are upset that someone is pointing the finger at your school, but I strongly suggest that you take the time to read this about, definitions, and recruiting budget pages before you comment again – I think you will see that you have a massive misunderstanding of the concept of oversigning and it will become clear to you that LSU and Alabama are violating the spirit of the recruiting process by exploiting a loophole in the NCAA rules that allows them to accept more LOI than they have room for under the 85 limit.

                • We knew the march to 85 would happen but we were sure how many young lives would be ruined by this cheating act of College Football recruiting.

  6. First off, LSU is denying that they weren’t willing to renew his scholarship. Now it’s a he said, he said situation (which is more than you usually have) but something doesn’t smell right. If LSU needed to cut somebody, you would think it would be an upperclass lineman who never sees the field, not the 3rd string QB when that position is shakey at best. If LSU did cut this guy then I will likely agree with you on this one as a redshirt freshman hasn’t had the time in the program to develop – but like I said, something’s fishy in this story.

    Secondly, let me make a request of you. Make a comparison of programs across the country, but not of the oversigning – of players leaving the team. I know players leave B10 teams just like they do the SEC, but is there a large difference between the two? How about the B12, ACC, Beast and P10? THAT is a reasonable thing to look at that will shine some light either on your theory or against it. If the SEC is comparable in attrition to other schools, then you have nothing to complain about except that your conference doesn’t allow your schools to be effecient, however if Bama, LSU, Auburn, Florida, et al have twice the attrition than the average school, I will start to come over to your way of thinking. This would take some real time and honest analysis which you have not shown to this point, but would go a long way to secure some credibility.

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