We All Know who Bernie Machen is Talking About
In Division I college football this practice is known as "grayshirting" and, unfortunately, there are universities that sanction this activity. The universities, with full knowledge of what they are doing, extend more athletic scholarships than they have. These schools play roulette with the lives of talented young people. If they run out of scholarships, too bad. The letter-of-intent signed by the university the previous February is voided. Technically, it's legal to do this. Morally, it is reprehensible.
Associated with "grayshirting" -- and equally disgusting -- is the nefarious practice of prematurely ending student-athletes' scholarships. Some are just not renewed even though the student-athlete is doing what is asked of him.
Some students are mysteriously given a "medical exemption" which ends their athletic careers -- and makes another scholarship available for the football coach to hand out.
To be clear, greyshirting is not the core issue here...it is the ethics and lack of a moral compass that leads to the, as Machen describes it, disgusting practice of pushing kids into medical hardships or cutting them from their scholarship. There is a particular coach in the SEC who is selling the greyshirt model and that same coach has had just as many or more medical hardships (13) than the rest of the SEC combined in the last 4-5 years. That is not by accident and it appears that Mr. Machen has had enough of it.
We believe that when handled properly, with complete transparency and extra care given to protect the student-athlete, there are unique situations that constitute a greyshirt opportunity.
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February 1st, 2011 - 11:23
and yet, he tells every player that may be a candidate for a gray shirt what the deal is. He doesnt sign them, and then tell them they have to gray shirt. Purge your hate, you will live longer. Machen would do better to spend his time stopping his basketball players from point shaving, or getting his football team to stop having so many players arrested. they have taken over the reputation as Thug U from Miami.
February 1st, 2011 - 12:05
Seriously, what is your problem? UF’s basketball team is point shaving now? Yeah, whatever you say. Those of us who went to UF are pretty sure the team just sucks, but if you make stuff up it must be true. And yes, obviously the football team is full of “thugs” when 3/4 of those arrests are for things like traffic violations or underage drinking, in which case 90% of the people you or I knew in college were probably “thugs” too according to you.
Georgia, by the way, has had more players arrested than UF has. And I can’t even imagine how many players are caught doing illegal things and let go at some other schools just because they’re football players. One UF player’s arrest was for throwing a sandwich at someone, which is beyond ridiculous, but the Gainesville cops were apparently willing to arrest someone for that. Do they do that in other college towns or do they just have fewer sandwich-throwing “thugs” there?
February 1st, 2011 - 15:40
http://espn.go.com/magazine/vol5no07dupay.html
not now, but not too long ago either.
February 1st, 2011 - 11:31
pushes kids to medical hardship? What, he breaks their knees or something.
February 1st, 2011 - 21:47
when the team doctor tells a kid he wont play again and he better accept this medical hardship. Pretty simple and Saban does it a heck of a lot.
February 2nd, 2011 - 07:19
you do know that medical redshirts have to be evaluated by a 3rd party right? it cannot be just a team doctor.
February 2nd, 2011 - 10:43
What’s going wrong at Alabama that they have as many career-ending injuries as the rest of the SEC combined?
February 2nd, 2011 - 11:29
that i couldnt tell you. I could say that it might seem fishy. I do know that quite a few of them were legitimate. Others might be questionable, i dont know enough about every situation to comment on that.
February 2nd, 2011 - 15:16
HA HA HA. “Other’s might be questionable.” That is hilarious.
Tre to earth: You damn right it’s questionable!
February 2nd, 2011 - 20:58
Yes, because a period of 4 years is enough time to form a conclusion. Ask any one in statistics and they will tell you that there can easily be that kind of deviation in 4 years.
February 3rd, 2011 - 08:07
i gave my honest opinion. I dont know enough about every situation to comment on them. the ones i do know were serious enough to warrant it. The ones that took the medical redshirts, the players themselves had to agree to it. I wasnt in the room, didnt talk to the doctors, so i dont know. I admitted that it seems fishy, what more do you want?
February 1st, 2011 - 11:48
Seriously – clearly Machen is NOT talking about Saban. Machen is talking about the coaches who surprise grayshirt kids. If he wasn’t, then clearly THIS wouldn’t be happening.
Complete transparency is what Nick Saban is all about during recruiting – EVEN YOU noted this a few weeks ago when you noted that Saban is the only one telling kids that the scholarships are one year renewables.
Sit down, take a breath, and get over your total, blinding hate of Nick Saban. It will make you a better blogger and a more persuasive voice for a cause you clearly believe in.
February 1st, 2011 - 11:53
oh snap, Machen’s own coach was offering grayshirts, but Machen doesnt condone the practice. I guess he should fire Meyer with cause then.
February 1st, 2011 - 12:20
I have no earthly idea why Meyer was only offering Brissett a grayshirt, since it certainly wasn’t a numbers problem, but yes, Machen is very clearly talking about the type of “grayshirting” some other schools do. I know Meyer offered one kid a grayshirt last year too, but those are the only two I know of. It is not a common thing at UF by any means, and is never EVER done after the kid has signed and has no other options.
Brissett was very clearly offered a grayshirt by Meyer from the very beginning. In fact, that is why he supposedly still holds a grudge against UF. He was not committed, signed, and then had his scholarship offer revoked after the fact. He had the option of accepting a UF grayshirt or a scholarship from another school, and he knew this months ago and chose not to commit to UF because of it. Muschamp has now offered him a scholarship anyway, and he’s still considering UF as far as I know.
I think there should be some kind of distinction between what Machen is talking about, which involves a school pulling a scholarship offer after it has been made, and an agreement from the beginning between the school and the player for him to enroll in the spring. Because there is a very big difference. And please don’t even try to pretend SABAN of all people is so ethical.
February 1st, 2011 - 14:29
The distinction definitely needs to be made.
For instance, a kid’s life-long dream school might – at the time the kid is in his recruitable years – stocked with freshmen/redshirt freshmen at his position (QB or K, for example). But the kid still wants to go there – but wants some reasonable chance at starting for a couple of years. So the kid and coaches decide together to create some distance between the kid and the current players.
That’s a perfectly acceptable use of the grayshirt, and no one is forced out or harmed in anyway.
February 2nd, 2011 - 20:44
Which is exactly how Coach Saban is using it. But, I guess if it is your coach grayshirting it is OK.
February 1st, 2011 - 15:43
Gerf,
Saban lets any recruit that might be a possible greyshirt up front know it. So that they can make up their mind themselves. He doesnt wait and spring it on a recruit at the last minute when their options might be more limited. He doesnt pull a scholarship and force them into a greyshirt.
And i love how Machen talks down about greyshirts in general when his own coach was using them, and now you want to make a distinction between them.
February 1st, 2011 - 14:04
WTF? Machen is NOT talking about transparency. Machen is not even implying something. Machen is explicitly calling Grayshirting an immoral and reprehensible behavior.
Machen MOST DEFINITELY IS talking about Alabama, Auburn, LSU, Ole Miss, MSU, SC, Arkansas…
There is no interpreting in his statement. Grayshirting should be illegal and it is already immoral.
February 1st, 2011 - 15:48
and yet, his own coach was offering recruits greyshirts. That is what makes it funny to me.
February 2nd, 2011 - 12:06
Not exactly sure why you have Auburn in your list there. Auburn hasn’t greyshirted anyone in years. They offered a grey shirt to a player a couple of years ago, but he ended up on scholarship from the beginning.
February 2nd, 2011 - 20:44
And Florida.
February 1st, 2011 - 12:37
Maybe the Big Ten will stop gray shirting recruits. Then maybe they will be allowed to recruit there again.
http://espn.go.com/blog/ncfnation/post/_/id/38813/purdue-barred-after-pulling-scholarship
February 1st, 2011 - 14:08
He didn’t sign a letter of intent or attend school. He had his verbal offer pulled because he was already infected by Angry Purdue Hating ACL God and Danny Hope didn’t want to mess with it.
Sucks? Most Definitely. Related all all to the topic of this website? No.
February 1st, 2011 - 15:05
Yes, the topic of this website is only SEC bashing.
February 1st, 2011 - 14:00
Shouldn’t the title be “We All Know About Whom Bernie Machen is Talking”?
Haha In all seriousness, finally! I really don’t understand how the Presidents of Alabama, Auburn, Ole Miss, MSU, LSU, and Arkansas can feel like they are doing their jobs. I would be embarrassed to be one of them at a national convention of other University Presidents who, you know, actually respect their responsibilities and academics’ place at a college.
Furthermore, I don’t know how grads of these schools don’t care more about their own investment…
February 1st, 2011 - 15:49
Bernie should work more on the point shaving/gambling issues in his basketball program and keeping his football players out of the police blotter. Oh, and dont talk bad about greyshirts when your own coach is offering them to recruits.
February 2nd, 2011 - 11:29
Dude, your a broken record. You spend a lot of time on this site for someone who completely disagrees with everything that is said.
February 2nd, 2011 - 12:57
i have never said that i disagree with everything that is said here
February 2nd, 2011 - 20:45
And he must be talking about Florida, too.
February 3rd, 2011 - 12:48
Why are you calling out Auburn, they are currently undersigned?
February 1st, 2011 - 14:07
I find it interesting that some many people are worked up about cutting scholarship player and Medical scholarships at the same time. If a player is not good enough to play on a team, so he is told that he will have to continue school for free on a medical scholarship, were is the harm to the student if he was never going to play?
February 1st, 2011 - 14:20
Asked and answered. Do some legwork right here on the site to find those discussions.
February 2nd, 2011 - 20:46
He doesn’t need to. He answered his own question. There is no harm in it. and a 3rd party is the one that makes that evaluation.
February 1st, 2011 - 14:18
Well done, Mr. Machen!
In as much as the college presidents are the NCAA, this is is where the dominoes begin to fall in actually implementing the needed solutions. The more we hear from these presidents the more deafening is the silence of those college presidents who choose inaction .
The other day, in complimenting this website and explaining why the light shines hottest on the SEC for the practice of oversigning, Rich wrote:
In commenting about the semi-pro/pro nature of college athletics as it relates to the oversigning issue, I added:
Kudos to Oversigning.com, and to all those who have taken up the cause, because your words and actions do have impact.
And certainly, I cannot forget the many oversigning defenders for the impact of all of their many posts here which demonstrate that, even after being permitted ample time and space to present the merits of oversigning, it remains an indefensible practice to any reasonable reader who understands and values the mission and place of higher education, and also respects the dignity of the involved student-athletes.
February 2nd, 2011 - 20:47
He must have been talking about his own school, then, which participates in it as well.
February 1st, 2011 - 15:09
Meanwhile, Houston Nutt & Ol Piss are fly’n hard under the radar to win the Oversigning Cup. On the homestretch with a few more to bring on board to stoke the numbers before the SEC finally acts.
Nutt’s gettin ‘er done!
February 1st, 2011 - 22:38
Hey Oversigners….If I do a poor job at my place of employment, will I get fired? Yes. This will happen at age 16 or 61. That’s life. Seems to me Saban treats his players like adults.
February 2nd, 2011 - 08:57
As an adult, you should appreciate that there are multiple criteria that must be used to make a single decision. Not one President or NCAA official will agree with your analogy since hundreds of millions of dollars are on the table if college football players are actually “employees” of the university. So, how does it feel to hold a belief that no one agrees with?
February 2nd, 2011 - 09:56
They are with scholarship money because they have a desirable skill. If they don’t perform they lose that scholarship money.
I don’t see the moral issue with it from a coaching standpoint. I do realize it would hurt deeply to be the student, as you lose your means to school. However, if I get fired I lose the means by which I feed my kids. It would suck. But that’s life. Perform or leave.
February 2nd, 2011 - 10:47
They have scholarships because Saban thought they’d be good players and because they could bring real profit to the U of A. You want it to be like the real world, then Alabama pays the star players in addition to their scholarship. Until players start getting paid, they deserve a four year scholarship to get their degree.
February 2nd, 2011 - 11:30
i agree with you that all scholarships should be 4 years, not 1 year renewable.
February 2nd, 2011 - 22:18
Funny how no one proposes the obvious solution. Just increase the scholarship caps.
“But schools can’t afford that!” Actually, the ones who over-sign can. Easily. Is this about fairness for the athletes, or is it about forcing the Alabamas and LSUs of the world to play by TCU rules?
February 3rd, 2011 - 08:10
some of us have said that, along with making scholarships 4-yr, that schools be allowed more scholarships. The 85-limit is archaic and doesnt mesh with the numbers. Why not 100, allowing schools 20 players a year. no fudging numbers, you can sign only 20 players a year no matter what.
February 2nd, 2011 - 11:01
Maybe Saban should start recruiting on an even playing field with the more ethical (non-oversigning) teams, then his bosses could make a better judgement about how he is doing.
Or do your rules not apply to guys making $5 mill a year?
February 2nd, 2011 - 11:12
College football players are employees? The IRS would like to know about it. A scholarship is a salary? The IRS would like to know about it. Every college football program in America would lose money if college football players were treated as employees in the “real world.” By the way, not only would there be taxing of revenue, but I know that OSHA would be very interested in the safety of working conditions for underage employees. Finally, the restraint of trade and the collusion to restrain trade issues would keep lots of people employed if college football was actually a “business” and players would treated like in the “real world.”
February 5th, 2011 - 12:25
It is win at all and any cost for those rednecks down there. The players are nothing more than a piece of meat to those fans. The players buy the used car salesmen and the next season get ran out of town. There should be an asterisk with the number of players next to it let go to get the championship next to ever sec title. The other conferences should boycott games with the sec.
February 1st, 2011 - 23:03
1 — Isn’t the real issue here supply and demand? As in, some schools suffer from the problem of having more kids who want to play than the school has scholarships to offer? I know Title IX factors into scholarship discussions, but that’s just another $ variable. Personally, I have no problem with schools who can fund more scholarship slots offering more scholarship slots. “It’s not fair!” You know what’s not fair? Telling Johnny he can’t play for State U because East, West, and North State U capped State U at their own level of economic viability. It’s a silly regulation. But a regulation nonetheless. Which brings us to….
2 — A college coach knows who’s making grades, who’s attending class, and who’s following the program rules. He knows what his limits really are. The Signing Day Math expressed here is something of a false and arbitrary deadline. Good for headlines, certainly. But it does assume that every kid on scholarship is on solid academic, disciplinary, and health grounds. In other words, a statistically improbable assumption.
3 — Medical exemptions: The kid stays in school for free. Morally reprehensible? Only if the doctor in question violates his medical oath and renders a false diagnosis. I would think such a false diagnosis would be easy to counter with second, third, and fourth opinions.
4 — Health of Players: On the one hand, we have media reports ripping a football culture that sweeps injuries under the rug and demands that guys “tough it out” against their own long-term health interests. And here we have people using the media to rip a program for doing the opposite, because those people have decided it must be solely because Coach wants a better prospect on the depth chart.
5 — Combine 4 and 5, and you essentially have a web site and a University President accusing medical professionals of violating their sworn adherence to professional standards. We’re talking world-renowned doctors in some cases here. THAT, to me, is morally reprehensible.
6 – John Blake was morally reprehensible. His behavior was disgusting, and I’m embarrassed he was every associated with my University. I know it’s an Internet Age, but I think people should think through the weight of words before they start hurling them in someone’s direction. Machen, as a University President, should know better.
February 1st, 2011 - 23:14
In support of #2, here is a quote from bucknuts.com (Your inside source for Ohio State sports!):
“We don’t always know a real number of scholarship spots available as there’s always the possibility that the staff may be aware of something that the public and media is not aware of, such as upcoming transfers and injury issues”
http://bucknuts.com/index.php/Football-Article/scholarship-count/menu-id-100.html
February 2nd, 2011 - 09:10
#3, medical professionals at universities are employees of the university. There is a long history of professional who work for a corporate entity (accountants, doctors and lawyers) who render opinions in favor of the employer. Who says that you need a fourth opinion to provide a medical redshirt?
#4, don’t understand your point.
#5, pretty overheated comment which ignores how practice occurs in many professions. Do lawyers, accountants and in-house medical professionals tailor opinions in “gray areas” to suit the the needs of their employers? Is this really a debatable issue?
February 2nd, 2011 - 10:58
3/5 – So labeling doctors as dishonest with no proof is fine, but having more medical exemptions than the school next door justifies moral outrage? Wow.
4 — Simple: Dennis Dodd just wrote a column calling the off-season the “killing season.” 13 Iowa players just ended up in the hospital. CFB takes an enormous physical toll. Maybe Saban is gaming the system, but I personally think medical exemptions should happen more often, not less. Currently, a player has to have something life-threatening or a risk of paralysis at some places to qualify. Given hard evidence of long-term physical hardship – including CFE – we should be seeing more use of this, not less.
And yes, also more transparency, provided student privacy isn’t violated. You’re never going to eliminate abuse. But don’t attack abuse in a way that effectively puts more kids at risk.
February 2nd, 2011 - 11:17
Saying that accountants, lawyers and medical professionals do not always abide by their professional standards, and in-house accountants, lawyers and medical professionals have an obligation to their employers should not generate a “wow.” I am sorry if you view this as a “shocker.” Would you be shocked to learn that the medical staff of teams in the NFL provide medical opinions in favor of the team and not the player? Is that also a “wow.”
February 2nd, 2011 - 12:09
Do CPAs always abide by their standards? In most cases…, yes, they do. “Fudging” is about the worst label you can toss at an accountant. I should know — my wife is one. She’s been in situations where someone pressured her to do something untoward. Someone like you who assumes it happens all the time. She’s stood her ground every time – even at the risk of her job.
Yes, doctors have been accused of keeping players on the field against their long-term health interests. I believe that’s the football culture I referred to earlier, which you said confused you.
So, given the option of focusing on a system which in its totality demonstrably emphasizes competition over health, you choose to call “morally reprehensible” the one entity flowing in the opposite direction.
To be clear, these kids remain on scholarship.
So, what’s your evidence that Saban’s crooked? He does it more often than others. Maybe he is gaming the system – but the long-term evidence even more strongly suggests that others should be doing this more often, not less.
Face it, you’re letting your antipathy towards Saban (which is understandable) cloud an important issue (which is regrettable).
February 2nd, 2011 - 19:51
If this reply is addressed to me, then your response is inadequate or incorrect on most counts. I will briefly show you why and if you need to defend your analysis again, then I will illustrate the inaccuracies in greater detail.
1. In terms of accountants, lawyers and medical personnel adhering to their professional standards — it is not an “either-or” or “all or nothing” situation.
2. You apparently no longer stand by the “wow” comment that anyone would dare to suggest that in-house medical doctors offer medical opinions that favor their employers — NFL or college. To say it is “cultural” means that — you now are backing off your previous response in which you took umbrage that the President of UF would — in your opinion — unfairly stigmatize doctors for not adhering to their professional standards. There are many uses of the very imprecise term “culture.” One is to use it to refer to a group of individuals who share a specific outlook on important issues — like the culture of the accountants at Enron. There is no doubt that NFL and College medical staff share a culture — and it is this culture that the UF President alludes to in a negative fashion.
2. I have no antipathy towards Nick Saban at all. I have no idea why you would say this.
3. If I do hold an antipathy towards the unit that is the collectivity known as the SEC for its consistent “race to the bottom” in how the conference, as a whole, treats academics and student athletes. Alabama was on probation for major NCAA violations before Nick Saban and unless the SEC culture changes, I have no doubt that they will be on probation after he leaves.
February 2nd, 2011 - 20:56
Unless you are an accountant or a lawyer, then you have absolutely no clue what you are talking about.
February 2nd, 2011 - 21:22
I am not backing off anything. I could not care less whether or not Alabama ends on probation. I have much more immediate concerns on that front for my own team.
The notion that professions shade interpretations towards the benefit of their employers? In some cases, that’s their job. But in others, it’s their job to go in the opposite direction. Hence the word “professionalism.”
You can’t have it both ways. If doctors are telling kids to get back on the field when they should not be there, then the correction needs to be for more medical exemptions. Period.
If, however, doctors are prematurely ending the careers of kids who otherwise might participate in order to create roster spots, then we have doctors allowing a preconceived agenda to determine their diagnosis or interpretation. That’s an egregious ethics violation in any profession. Accusing someone of that with no evidence? Yeah. Wow. That, in part, is what Machen did. That, in part, is what o/s.com praises.
The amount of “talk” about Saban and medical redshirts versus the amount of “talk” about the long-term health of college football players is ridiculous. As a result, the molehill gets all the attention and the mountain might as well not even exist. I think UF’s President was out of bounds in some of his comments, and I think oversigning.com was short-sighted in its blanket glorification of them.
Have at the “inaccuracies” if you like.
February 2nd, 2011 - 20:49
#3, medical professionals at universities are employees of the university. There is a long history of professional who work for a corporate entity (accountants, doctors and lawyers) who render opinions in favor of the employer. Who says that you need a fourth opinion to provide a medical redshirt?
—————————-
LOL, OK, that doesn’t happen as much as you like. Are we going to be told about how individual stock brokers all subvert the Stock Market as well?
February 2nd, 2011 - 15:21
Go to the oversigning cup. All of the schools that are +5 are Scum.
They are Ole Miss, Alabama, USC, LSU, Arkansas, South Carolina and Miss State. Pretty much all SEC schools. (USC might be ok if their appeal goes thru). Is it any wonder the SEC is cleaning up recruiting and winning national titles? It is because of this issue.
It is ashame that the NCAA just stands by and let’s this crap continue while other conferences and schools do not participate in this unethical behavior. What a sham NCAA football has become.
February 2nd, 2011 - 15:24
Chronic oversignors need to make their numbers….
Watch how over the next 12 months you will see many of these players wash out of Division I football via the usual expulsion tactics; creative medical hardships, mysterious violation of team rules; gray shirting; transfers; etc, etc, etc….
February 2nd, 2011 - 20:54
You’re clueless. Every single one of the players that Coach Saban kicked off the team had verifiable issues and were trouble makers. We had one guy pull a bb gun on some students and act like he was robbing them, we had one guy who kept smoking marijuana, we had one guy who kept breaking the team rules.
I guess you would have wanted us to keep all those guys to prove we weren’t gaming the system. What a joke this is.
What I want to know is if and when you guys get these rules you keep bitching for, and Alabama is still winning all the time, what other rule will you be crying for to “level” the playing field? The NCAA has already changed several rules because of the crybabies at other school and THAT obviously didn’t “level” the playing field enough, so now you’re looking at more rules.
Why don’t you just get the NCAA pass a rule that states “Alabama can only have 65 players on scholarship, because that is the only way we can compete with them.”
I’d have more respect for you if you were just honest and admitted that you can’t compete and that is why you want to implement all these rules to “level” the playing field.
February 2nd, 2011 - 22:55
“”I’d have more respect for you if you were just honest and admitted that you can’t compete and that is why you want to implement all these rules to “level” the playing field.”"
What do you mean I can’t compete? I don’t play football. I just watch it.
And yes, while you stick your head in the sand and ignore the issues, the rest of the country is on to the SEC’s little dirty tricks. Yes…we all want a level playing field. Play by the same rules everyone plays by and things will be fair. While the SEC tolerates oversigning and other conferences do not, things are not level.
The NCAA needs to put an end to this abuse.
February 3rd, 2011 - 08:12
and yet, everyone in the country plays by the same rules, except the big 10+2.
February 5th, 2011 - 12:20
You find this acceptable? No problem with selling a kid to come to your program and then cutting him lose to make room for someone else a year or two later while ruining his playing career in the process. I’m darn happy the big ten doesn’t practice this type of low life behavior. You guys are the champs and you can have the satisfaction that you give a bunch of unhappy rednecks something to live for who really could care less about the players. I’m glad my school is better than that. we don’t want to be like you.
February 5th, 2011 - 12:17
The big ten should be capitalizing on this and explaining to the recruits parents the dangers of signing with an sec used car salesmen dirtbag. The sec is a dirtbag conference. The only coach there I can make an exception for is Mark Richt. I hope he gets back to winning next year. It’s rotten that destroying a players playing career is such a widely accepted practice. I’m sure fewer would sign if they knew these things. The parents atleast should know what their kids are getting into.